HomeMy WebLinkAboutZONING BOARD OF APPEALS - 03/11/2021 - ZBA Docket 21-1, 2080 Lunt Avenue19:48:46 1
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STATE OF ILLINOIS
SS.
COUNTY OF COOK
I N RE:
KALEB JORDAN, CORGAN
Docket No. 21-1
The hearing in the above -
entitled cause before Mary Woolsey, a Certified
Shorthand Reporter, within the County of Cook and
State of Illinois, taken pursuant to the
provisions of the Zoning Board of Appeals of the
Village of Elk Grove Village, at 901 Wellington
Avenue, Elk Grove Village, Illinois, on the 11th
day of March, 2021, at the hour of 7:00 o'clock
p.m.
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PRESENT:
ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS
CHAIRMAN DONALD G. CHILDRESS
MR. RYAN BOOKLER
MR. RICHARD M. ROMANSKI
MR. ROBERTO SERRANO
MR. DONATO LATROFA
MR. TONY DAMPTZ, JR.
MR. JAKE GLIMCO
ON BEHALF OF THE VILLAGE:
MR. BRYAN KOZOR
ON BEHALF OF THE PETITIONER:
MR. KALEB JORDAN
MR. JAMIE PUTNAM
MARY WOOLSEY, C.S.R. 630.248.3415
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MR. CHILDRESS: It's approximately
7:00 p.m. My name is Don Childress. I'll go
ahead and read the docket and then ask whoever --
Mr. Jordan, if you're here, if you'd like to stand
up at the podium and then I'll swear you in and
then we'll have any questions of the Board members
to you and then take any questions or comments
from engineering and from the audience attending.
This is Elk Grove Vi l l age
Legal Notice for ZBA Docket 21-1.
Public notice is hereby given
that in accordance with the provisions of Chapter
8-2:D of the Zoning Ordinance of the Village of
Elk Grove Village, the Zoning Board of Appeals of
the Village will conduct a public hearing at the
hour of 7:00 p.m. on March 11, 2021, at the
Charles J. Zettek Municipal Building, 901
Wellington Avenue, Elk Grove Village, Illinois, to
consider the petition of Kaleb Jordan of Corgan
Architects, seeking a variation from the
provisions of the Elk Grove Village Ordinance No.
2410 as it pertains to permitted locations for
fences in industrial zoning districts.
Section 7E-9:(A) prohibits
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fences in excess of six feet from being
constructed in the required front yard and ahead
of the building setback line. The petitioner is
requesting to install an eight -foot -high open
black security fence with brick covered CMU,
concrete masonry unit, columns whose perimeter
will extend approximately 72 feet east beyond the
front corner of the principal structure that abuts
Nicholas Boulevard.
The property is located at
2080 Lunt Avenue, Elk Grove Village, Illinois and
is identified by the fol 1 owi ng property
identification number -- skip that.
All persons interested are
invited to attend and will be given the
opportunity to be heard. This hearing will be
accessible to individuals with disabilities.
Persons requiring accommodations are requested to
contact the Village Clerk at (847) 357-4040
preferably no later than five days before the
hearing.
Mr. Jordan, can you step up to
the microphone and raise your right hand and swear
to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
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MR. JORDAN: I will tell the whole
truth and nothing but the truth.
(Mr. Jordan was sworn in.)
MR. CHILDRESS: Thank you. Can you
present your rationale for the zoning variance
request.
MR. JORDAN: Sure. Stream, the
building owner, would like to request a zoning
variance for the added secure fencing proposed to
be located on the east side of the building
exterior in order to meet the tenant's requirement
for security standards. The basis of our request
is founded on the following items. The entire
proposed secure fencing is located well within the
established setbacks and fencing design provides
minimal to no site line obstruction to the
facility, images included. The column design will
aesthetically match the approved existing secure
fencing on site. The special nature of a data
center requires a higher level of security and
only authorized personnel are allowed to access
the facility. There will be no adverse impact to
adjacent neighboring properties.
And that's the case that we're
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MR. CHILDRESS: Okay. Can you --
I'll go ahead and ask the Board members for
questions if that's all right for now.
Roberto.
MR. SERRANO: Well, no questions but
I just have some feedback. I did pass by the
property today.
MR. JORDAN: Sure.
MR. SERRANO: And reviewed all the
materials provided. And it looks like your letter
dated in February is an extension of original
communication provided in January of 2021. And it
looks like, you know, all the questions were
addressed. And I am in agreement with the four
bullet points that are listed in the letter
addressed in February and agree that there are no
site line obstructions. Aesthetically, it's in
line with the existing fencing.
I guess my only question or
thought -- not even a question -- is does it
really need to be eight feet instead of six feet?
But that's sort of minor to me. But I am in
agreement with the higher level of security and I
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don't see any adverse impact. That's my feedback.
MR. CHILDRESS: Thank you. Ryan.
MR. BOOKLER: Sure. So, first of
all, thank you for all the documentation and
thanks for choosing Elk Grove for your business.
We appreciate that.
A couple of things. So you
said there's a security standard that requires the
fence to be eight feet high. What security
standard is this? Is this by the company? Is
this some outside security firm?
MR. JORDAN: Correct. No. This is
per the tenant that is moving into the building.
This is a large -- can we say the tenant?
MR. PUTNAM: Let's keep it at tenant
probably.
MR. JORDAN: This is part of their
standard security protocol which they are very
rigid in the detailing nature of those security
requirements. So we have that standard
information from the tenant.
MR. BOOKLER: Okay. So I didn't see
any issues with the existing fence, if that's
going to go there. I was fine with that and it's
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going to stay open; correct?
MR. JORDAN: Correct.
MR. BOOKLER: And there are concrete
slabs that are going to go in there as well in
between?
MR. JORDAN: We're just matching the
columns that are already on site. It's actually a
CME block -- it's actually a stucco finish.
MR. BOOKLER: And how far apart --
how many of those -- I'm sorry. Maybe they were
in here.
MR. JORDAN: Yeah. They're on there.
We're trying to maintain the -- within the 75-foot
max distance between them in just putting them in.
Some of the existing landscape islands, just so it
makes sense, and reducing the amount of demolition
that we would need to do for those.
MR. BOOKLER: Okay. And then one
last question. I know you said you're going to
keep it open. In the back on that north part that
runs along the railroad tracks, you have that
blocked like you've got panels there, which I get
because there's train there.
MR. JORDAN: Sure.
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MR. BOOKLER: So that would not at
all go in there?
MR. JORDAN: No, that would not.
MR. BOOKLER: Okay. All right.
Thank you.
MR. CHILDRESS: Donato.
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MR. LATROFA: Yeah. So I was kind of
confused at first looking at the diagram. But
once I figured it out, it seemed kind of strange
to me to have half of it blocked off and the other
half of it open and then to have it one way. Is
there an issue or a reason that you haven't sought
getting the entire lot secured?
MR. JORDAN: I think the main reason
was staying within the setbacks, we were trying to
stay as far away from the easement as possible.
And the reason for the one -direction flow of it
was just to reduce confusion as people are pulling
onto the property. And only doing half of it was
to meet the amount of spaces that the tenant was
requiring to be, you know, fenced in there. So
that was some of the reasoning behind it.
MR. LATROFA: You're going to be --
the fact that you didn't want to -- didn't want to
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potentially touch any easement, that doesn't
really move the needle for me because you're here
anyway seeking a variance so why not get the
variance for the entire parking lot or a bigger
chunk of the parking lot?
MR. PUTNAM: If you want, I can
answer that.
MR. CHILDRESS: Come up to the podium
and tell me your name and do you swear to tell the
whole truth and nothing but the truth.
MR. PUTNAM: I do. Jamie Putnam,
Kimley Horn, Civil Engineers.
(Mr. Putnam was sworn in.)
MR. PUTNAM: So the answer to that
one is how it's set up on the plan is the parking
lot itself is right on basically the property
line. So when you go into the 25-foot, the
parking stalls themselves, so to keep out of
the -- I'll call it the sacred 25-foot easement
area, it would put the fence and it would block
off these extra stalls right here. So, you know,
working with engineering and staff all the time,
it's always been said if you don't have to be
anywhere inside that 25-foot easement, stay
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outside the 25-foot easement. So that was the
reason with the tenant only these many stalls. If
you put the fence way outside, I don't know if
that variance would be requested because there are
additional water main, sanitary, other easements
that are running in through there that get frowned
upon when I submit something like that to the
engineering department.
MR. LATROFA: That answers that one
question but then it kind of begs the second
question. You know, with the snow storms that
we've had the last couple years, this is going to
be an absolute nightmare for your tenant in terms
of snow removal and getting plows in and out. How
are we going to address that in terms of like a
safety for both the tenant and for any potential
visitors for like a premises liability question?
MR. PUTNAM: Yeah. So I would
imagine with the -- so in the existing condition
they're going to put it in a corner.
MR. LATROFA: Right. Of course.
MR. PUTNAM: So here would open up
like the bad snow we had, they would still have
the ability because these stalls aren't being used
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if you can see that, the ones as you come right on
in, so they would have the ability to pile it
against there, but they have to be very diligent
obviously with the snow removal because there's
also, I image, the security -- speaking out loud,
you can't have that snow piled up either, so it's
going to be something they have to keep off of
that area because you don't want to have a
security issue of somebody being able to climb up
a snow pile to be able to get over the fence.
MR. LATROFA: Sure.
MR. PUTNAM: So they're going to have
to be very diligent on making sure that they would
have to work through and find a way to make sure
that they do not pile snow up to block people
coming in, to block visitors or anything like
that.
MR. LATROFA: Well, and, frankly,
even to get the snow out of there.
MR. PUTNAM: Correct.
MR, LATROFA: Right now the way I'm
reading this plan is you're only going to have an
opening up near the triangle. And then I'm
guessing this is another opening down here at the
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bottom that's unmarked in order for people to kind
of cycle through.
MR. PUTNAM: Correct.
MR. LATROFA: So I mean, it's
something that, you know, this --
MR. PUTNAM: They will have to work
through that in their -- yeah.
MR. LATROFA: I'm having, you know,
visions of just snow piles and difficulty in
somebody walking to work falling down, and then
because of this -- how my lawyer brain works,
they're going to come back to this meeting and
they're going to say did you guys think about -snow
pile? Is the Village potentially negligent here
in not identifying these things? So -- and I
don't know, Don, if this is something that, you
know, we can touch on. Me, personally, if there's
a way we can make the fence the bigger part of the
parking lot so the snow removal is easier, and I
think it looks cleaner with the property, if that
makes sense structurally engineering wise and cost
wise, obviously, right, because as the building
owners, you guys have a cost that you're trying to
meet. I get it. For the tenant, you know,
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wanting to secure the property. I just wonder if
this is necessarily the best way to go about doing
that given that there's potentially other issues.
MR. PUTNAM: And usually in my
experience working on data centers here in Elk
Grove Village, it's always keep these -- if you're
going to cross it, just barely cross it because
there's so many utilities, engineering staff will
frown upon that because if somebody ever has to --
a water main break, a sanitary sewer break,
electrical lines have the right to go through
here, they're going to have the ability, then, to
rip down that entire fence because it's in that
easement area, and then just go back to the tenant
and say there you go, there's your fence, it's
knocked down, security go put it back up yourself.
MR. LATROFA. Yeah. No. And I get
it. It's a balancing act.
MR. PUTNAM: It's a balancing act. I
don't know if I can ask you, Bryan. I don't know
if Mary and staff would or Jared would even
entertain the ability to put it that far out
there.
ZO As designed,
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probably the best way to meet all standards and
requirements with setbacks and location.
MR. LATROFA: My other question then
could be -- it seems as though these -- however
many there are, 10, 15 parking spaces just outside
the gate, it seems as though those don't really
from reading it, any sort of visitors are going to
need to have permission to go to the building and
things like that. You know, would you be able to
extend the fence out to the end of that but still
avoid being that much -- basically to the end of
where those lots are -- I don't know -- just
trying to think of a way that you can keep this
clean and your tenant still has access that they
need but we're also avoiding any sort of areas
where we're getting unnecessary snow. It just
seems like this line where it's drawn, if we can
get it out a little further -- and I understand
you have those concrete -- what are those called,
those like partitions?
MR. PUTNAM: The pillars.
MR. LATROFA: Well, yeah. Not the
pillars. But the actual like spaces there in
between.
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MR. ROMANSKI: For the parking lot.
Are you thinking like extend this here?
MR. LATROFA: No. No. To the east.
MR. ROMANSKI: This way? I would
more talk about extending it this way then you
would have the gate here because otherwise this is
kind of like dead space.
MR. LATROFA: Sure. That could
potentially work as well, and that would tie in
with the other fence, too.
MR. DAMPTZ: In other words, enclose
all the parking spaces?
MR. ROMANSKI: Well, no. My thoughts
are, as you guys can see in the picture, is why
not lust extend this out to here when they're
driving in, have the gate right here and then
all -- because otherwise you have this -- when it
comes to snow removal, this is going to be a pain
in the butt to get snow out of here, especially
with big snowfalls, right? So if this fence was
gone here instead and you extend this out, that
would probably be a lot easier for everything. I
don't know if that's something you guys considered
or not. See what I'm talking about? Why don't
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you extend this fence to here. That would make
the entrance right here and that way you won't
have this.
MR. CHILDRESS: Well
MR. LATROFA: It might make a lot of
sense, too, because it's actually putting in a
little bit less fence if you're doing it that way.
MR. ROMANSKI: And actually gives you
more of a secure area, too.
MR. PUTNAM: The thought was if you
have somebody that's coming -- more for the
visitors, too. So if visitors are coming in, this
gives them the spot that they can pull close to
the building and then they're calling in the
intercom and they're waiting, the fence goes over
here, they're kind of -- I don't know -- because
the intercom would be right there.
MR. JORDAN: Yeah.
MR. LATROFA: Realistically, the
people that are coming to visit aren't going to be
using the intercom. They're going to be calling
their friends, you know, inside.
MR. PUTNAM: Well, they should be
preapproved to come here anyway. So the only time
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you get the visitors is the rare occurrences is
what they were. And, I guess, the thought, too,
is how it's set up, is if a snowplow does come,
they're going to have open access so the gates
just open up, so they have free reign to circle
the whole - -
MR. LATROFA: Have you ever driven a
snowplow in a parking lot like that? I have.
It's awful. I plowed when I was in college. It
is awful. Your plowman is going to do an awful
job. If he or she is pulling a 12-hour or 24-hour
shift, I think you're doing your tenant a
potential disservice. I get the flow. And I
think his amendment is kind of a suggestion is one
that would help. One, it would give your tenant
two more close parking spots within the secure
area. Two, if they are really worried about
security, they don't want unmarked or unvetted
spots that much closer to the building, right?
So, if anything, you would want to keep those
close spots within the secured area. And, three,
in terms of ease of flow and things like that.
And, four, it looks like that might actually end
up being potentially cheaper for your client, your
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boss if you only have to put a fence, you know,
whatever that is, 12 feet across instead of
running it 15 feet or 18 feet or 25 feet east to
west. You're just running it 12 feet south to
north. Something to think about.
MR. ROMANSKI: Kind of going along
with what he's talking about, the snowplowing, I
mean, I'm a vice president of my association here
in town, and I don't even foresee how they're
going to be getting the snow out of here unless
they're planning on dropping off a Bobcat to get
that snow out of there. That snow is not going to
get plowed if it's in that "L" shape area.
MR. LATROFA: Two or three days like
this past winter.
MR. ROMANSKI: All they're going to
do is put it against here and put it up higher.
There's nowhere else for them to take that snow
unless they physically have a Bobcat there to
scoop up the snow and get it out of there. So
it's going to make maintenance a lot easier. It's
going to make -- it's probably easier aesthetics
because, again, what he's saying, you're only
going to go an extra 12 feet instead of 20 feet
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this way. I personally think that's a better
option for you guys and probably cleaner lines and
things like that. Sorry.
MR. LATROFA: Working together, man.
Those are kind of the points that I had in kind of
y looking at the notes.
MR. ROMANSKI: The only other
question, I guess, I have, everything looks pretty
clean for the most part. I know we have an email
here from the neighbor to the west; correct? Do
we have any information from the neighbors
directly south and directly across the street on
Nicholas? Are they aware you guys want to put up
a fence?
MR. JORDAN: Which direction did you
say?
MR. ROMANSKI: South and then to the
east. So across the street on Nicholas and across
the street on Lunt. Are those current owners
aware that you guys are looking to put up a fence
and asking for a variances?
MR. PUTNAM: It would have been sent
out in the --
MR. KOZOR: All notifications went
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out that are in the circle of notification and the
signs were posted on the building at each
intersection. So yes, all building owners were
given an opportunity to attend the hearing or call
staff to ask questions.
MR. ROMANSKI: All right. Thank you.
I'm good.
MR. CHILDRESS: Tony, do you have any
questions?
MR. DAMPTZ: I have one question. Is
this the only access even for emergency vehicles?
MR. JORDAN: No. This is access --
you can see directly to the north of it and on the
other side of the building. I don't have the full
assembly of drawings there, but on the plan west
of the building as well there's also an entry to
the building.
MR. DAMPTZ: So that would be more
for emergency vehicles? I don't see a fire truck
making that turn.
MR. JORDAN: We do have Knox boxes at
each one of the locations as well.
MR. PUTNAM: So yeah, there's the
access here that runs around the site on the far
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west. And then there's access on the northeast
corner at the top that run through the back area.
And then the car parking lot has got the single
access.
MR. JORDAN: It's more for front of
house.
MR. PUTNAM: So they do have
emergency vehicles have access on all four sides.
MR. CHILDRESS: Jacob, do you have
any questions or comments?
MR. GLIMCO: Thank you again for all
the work that you guys have put in to present this
for us. I did have a follow-up on Ryan's question
about -- so you mentioned that the eight -foot
fence is a requirement by the tenant moving in.
If this fence was not approved, would it be hard
to continue with bringing the tenant in?
MR. JORDAN: It would.
MR. PUTNAM: Yes.
MR. JORDAN: It would make things
difficult.
MR. PUTNAM: And that's with all --
due to the standard fence variance we're always
asking in the Vi l l age is to go from six to eight
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feet for that specific requirement.
MR. GLIMCO: That's all the questions
I have.
MR. CHILDRESS: I'm just asking a
question regarding the snow removal. I work as a
civil engineer also, mostly with Illinois Tollway
and similar agencies but -- and with maintenance.
I know they with bigger plows have to manage snow
within their whatever rights of way and things
like that. Would these type of facilities, do
they use truck -mounted plows or Bobcats?
MR. PUTNAM: They're not going to
bring anything big out there to do because the
only pavements that's really out there is just the
drive --
MR. CHILDRESS: Right.
MR. PUTNAM: -- that come around and
then the small parking lot.
MR. ROMANSKI: It would depend on
whoever they hire.
MR. CHILDRESS: And each facility or
owner tenant will contract with local providers of
equipment like that.
MR. PUTNAM: Yes. But they're not
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going to want -- I can't see -- just speaking out
loud, but I can't see like the owner of this
wanting to bring in the big snowplow or the big
trucks running through the parking lot, especially
being a secured facility.
MR. ROMANSKI: But even if it's, say,
a Ford pickup truck that's doing the plowing,
there is no way he's going to be able to get that
snow out of this area, whereas a Bobcat can scoop
it up and move it out of the way. Or just extend
the fence, then you basically have two sections,
you have nice clean site lines. Especially if you
do it that way, you can push everything this way
and work towards the street and then it's just
going to be easier to maintain for whatever
company you hire because if it's left the way it
is, whoever they hire, from my experience, they're
going to say, hey, we want to keep a Bobcat on
site, there's more money to your tenant or more
money to you guys, whoever owns the property,
because they're not going to be able to plow
certain areas. They're going to have to pick up
that snow and move it elsewhere on the property.
MR. BOOKLER: You said the spaces are
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not going to be used much; is that correct?
MR. PUTNAM: In the fence they will
X3
MR. BOOKLER: I'm sorry?
MR. PUTNAM: In the fenced area they
will be. That will be for the employees. That's
why they needed that level of security is for all
the employees.
MR. BOOKLER: So I can see if you
have cars that are parked there like you were
talking about.
MR. PUTNAM: Yes.
MR. BOOKLER: That would make it hard
for snowplows and cars.
MR. ROMANSKI: That's why you extend
this thing out -- you extend it out this way and
when they turn in here, you got your call button
whatever you called it.
MR. PUTNAM: Intercom.
MR. ROMANSKI: Put the intercom here
on this concrete area there and then it should
flow a lot easier. That's just my opinion.
MR. CHILDRESS: But, Bryan, would any
modification to the fence in that little area,
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would that affect our zoning variance request?
MR. KOZOR: Yes, it would.
MR. CHILDRESS: Are there any other
questions from Board members?
Thank you for the well -made
exhibits. You know, I drove by the property this
morning. There doesn't look to be any utility
issues like you've already accommodated all those
in your design as far as drainage and other type
of utilities. was there below grade stor ter?
MR. PUTNAM: It's underground
detention.
MR. CHILDRESS: Underground
detention. So none of that will ever or should
ever back up.
MR. PUTNAM: No. It's all designed
to be -- it's designed for the hundred -year event
to be under pavement.
MR. CHILDRESS: To percolate and then
have restrictors to limit flow offsite.
MR. PUTNAM: Yeah. It will actually
get into the system. There's no -- it gets into
the system and then actually drains out in the
southeast corner over here.
• i1 630.248.3415
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MR. CHILDRESS: Into the other ditch
line.
MR. PUTNAM: So it goes into the
storm system that runs along the street.
MR. CHILDRESS: Along the street.
The storm sewer system.
MR. PUTNAM: Yep. That's all taken
care of.
MR. CHILDRESS: And there is no
impacts with railroad or anything like that
because you're all parallel to it?
MR. PUTNAM: Yeah. We worked that
out with the original building with the railroad
and everybody else. They all signed off.
MR. CHILDRESS: So you have all those
permissions or easements or whatever --
MR. PUTNAM: Oh, yeah.
MR. CHILDRESS: -- squared away
already?
MR. PUTNAM: Yep.
MR. CHILDRESS: You know, the
placement of the fence that you have in the one
exhibit basically bisected the parking spaces so
you have visitor parking on the outside, the
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tenant staff or vendor or contractor whatever
parking on the interior. You know, the
placement -- or the, I guess, the position,
movement of the fence north or projection could be
an alternative or whatever but do we need --
Bryan, would we need to raise the motion
differently if we recommended that be an
alternative for the property owner or tenant
engineer to work out with the Village if they
wanted to have a different alignment of that north
leg of the fence?
MR. KOZOR: Yeah. I mean, if you're
going out any further than was advertised to the
community, then it would have -- it potentially
would have to go back out to be readvertised.
MR. ROMANSKI: It's not really going
out further. It's just --
MR. CHILDRESS: It's not really going
out further.
MR. ROMANSKI: -- instead of making
the hard left, this part goes away and you extend
it whatever the 12 feet so it goes from fence to
fence.
MR. KOZOR: You can make whoever
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motion you choose to make.
Did you read in the letter
that -- the email that staff received?
MR. CHILDRESS: Can I read this into
the information for the meeting. This letter
received from the public was from Dan Bartel 1 o
from Drug Source, Incorporated concerning the
hearing tonight.
"Dear Bryan: Thank you for
the additional information. I have no objection
to the addition of the fence on Nicholas
Boulevard -- on the Nicholas Boulevard side of the
building. If there are any thoughts of putting
the fence between our buildings, I would have to
object to it. Let me know if you need anything
else. Dan Bartello, President/CEO Drug Source,
Inc., P.O. Box 1366, Elk Grove Village."
Bryan, does -- do you know
what specific address on Lunt?
MR. KOZOR: It's the building to the
west.
MR.
CHILDRESS: Building
to
the
west.
MR.
PUTNAM: Yeah, he is
on
the
west
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MR. CHILDRESS: Do you know what
the -- I guess what the address would be or it's
just the building immediately to the west?
MR. KOZOR: I believe it's 2020 Lunt.
MR. CHILDRESS: 2021?
MR. KOZOR: 2020.
MR. CHILDRESS: 2020.
MR. BKLER: So the potential snow
that would impact the property, if that's the
case; right?
MR. ROMANSKI: It could impact
security. If we get another big snowfall, the
plow can't go anywhere but push it forward. If
they keep pushing it forward, it's just going to
pile up at that end of the wall of the fence and
they can either get in to the left or to the
right. There is no flow for that snow to go. All
they can do is push it there. Whereas, if you
have it like what I'm suggesting, they can always
push it out into the street, if anything, and then
put it on the -- or the outside part of the
parking lot over here. You're not going to be
able to push this snow anywhere but -- if we get a
lot of snow, if we get five inches, that's going
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to probably pile three, four feet high easy and
then people can hop the fence and so much for your
security.
MR. PUTNAM: They would definitely
have to get that removed. They would have to get
that removed because it couldn't be on site for
the security risk like you said.
MR. ROMANSKI: Then whatever company
they hire, right, would have to then come in,
bring something else in because the plow they use
isn't going to be enough. Now, they have to bring
in a truck or something to move it, a Bobcat. Now
you're shipping another piece of equipment there.
A lot of different logistics. To me, I look at it
it's probably less expensive for you guys to
extend the fence a shorter distance versus making
a hard left and then extending it further.
MR. LATROFA: And I think that would
be consistent with what your client -- your
tenant's desires are. It doesn't seem to make
much sense for there to be those two spots that
much closer to the building. If their security
really is and, of course, I don't know the layout
inside the building, but if security is that
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important to them, I would think they don't want
any spots or they want all the spots closer to the
building to be part of the security lot.
MR. JORDAN: The reason I think we
had it pulled back and running up into the
sidewalk is we do have a man door that's at both
sides of it, so it allows for equal opportunity
exiting outside of the secured fencing. If we
kept - - instead of jogging i t , if we just
continued it north, I don't think that would be a
big issue and it might solve some logistical
problems.
MR. CHILDRESS: Having the fencing as
it is now, is that more in line with, you know,
like a man door to secure or unsecured areas, is
that something that had to be coordinated with the
property owner or the fire department as far as
where different security levels of individuals
could ingress or egress into the building?
MR. PUTNAM: We worked with this
through the fire department.
MR. JORDAN: We submitted everything.
MR. PUTNAM: We sent it to --
MR. CHILDRESS: That was all part of
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the Village's review?
MR. PUTNAM: Yes.
MR. JORDAN: That was in November.
MR. PUTNAM: Yep.
MR. BOOKLER: Bryan, did the Village
have any issues engineering with the layout for
snowplow or anything or getting emergency vehicles
like Tony was talking about in?
MR. KOZOR: Nope.
MR. BOOKLER: None. You guys didn't
have any concerns with snow impact and the plows?
MR. KOZOR: No.
MR. BOOKLER: I guess it could be
addressed, too, if they talk to a couple snowplow
companies and said, Hey, how do you think that's
going to work? That's an option.
MR. CHILDRESS: In a way that is
almost like contractor methods and equipment, you
know, you contract with a contractor and it's
between the building owner and that vendor how
much resources.
MR. ROMANSKI: Right. What would
typically happen is like for our association, for
example, they're going to drop off a Bobcat.
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You're going to have a Bobcat in your parking lot
the entire time you're there. I don't know if
that's something the building owner would want.
MR. PUTNAM: We will definitely bring
up that concern that you guys have to the tenant
or to the owner.
MR. ROMANSKI: That would be the only
way to really get the snow out of there, they
would have to keep a permanent Bobcat basically
from mid November, probably, to like mid April.
That's usually what a snowplow contract goes for,
and that's where it's going to stay. So if
they're going to probably put it in the unsecured
area -- the other thing is whoever is doing the
plowing, I'm assuming you guys have to give that
company access to get inside the secure area.
MR. PUTNAM: Yes, they would have
approval. Absolutely.
MR. ROMANSKI: Keep in mind, it could
be a different driver every time so depending on
how you guys arrange the security. It would have
to be a Bobcat. So if they're looking for
aesthetics and everything and they don't want to
have a Bobcat sitting there for four months out of
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the year, more power to them. I would like to
hear what they think of that.
MR. PUTNAM: We can bring it up to
them with that.
MR. JORDAN: Could this be the
designated Bobcat area?
MR. CHILDRESS: Do we want to have a
motion maybe on just the position of the fence as
is and let the property owners deal with their
contractor and the snow removal issues since the
property owner and civil engineer have already
coordinated with the Village as far as the
intercom and call boxes and the positioning and
the one-way traffic flow and also the additional
space to allow a wrong way driver to back up and
turn around if they realize they're going opposite
whatever the clockwise or whatever the traffic
direction would be within the site as intended by
the building owners and civil engineer.
MR. PUTNAM: Sure.
MR. CHILDRESS: Could we -- Are there
any other questions?
MR. DAMPTZ: I have one question.
Which way do your gates open? Do they open inside
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or is it one gate?
MR. JORDAN: Currently we're showing
it as one gate on a track that matches one of the
other gates that's currently on the facility.
MR. DAMPTZ: So if we move that fence
over, would the gate go --
MR. ROMANSKI: If they move it over
here, they would have it roll this way.
MR. CHILDRESS: Are there any other
questions of engineering?
This -- where the gate is
positioned now -- or I guess to the northeast of
the building, those three parking spaces were
designed because of --
MR. JORDAN: In the rare instance
that there would be someone that needed a
temporary parking spot as they may be waiting on
someone to come from -- after they've spoken to
the intercom to come verify they can come onto the
property. That was the thought process behind
there.
MR. CHILDRESS: But that was already
reviewed with the building owners as to what the
intent of the functionality of the site would be?
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MR. JORDAN: Correct.
MR. PUTNAM: Absolutely.
MR. CHILDRESS: And also with the
Village for the call box or intercom positioning
and the traffic flow in and out?
MR. PUTNAM: Yep.
MR. CHILDRESS: What -- what -- Board
members, what do you -- do you feel we should just
vote on the zoning variation as -- or as --
MR. ROMANSKI: I would prefer
extending the fence out and moving the intercom.
That would be my recommendation. It's smoother
flow. It's smoother everything.
MR. CHILDRESS: Is that something
that would affect your functionary use or is that
something we can --
MR. JORDAN: I don't think it would
affect that. You said move the intercom, though?
I think we would try to keep the intercom at the
same location that we're showing currently.
MR. PUTNAM: The intercom is
currently on the island so they're going to sit in
the same spot either way.
MR. ROMANSKI: You're going to have
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NO
it right here on the island? That's where I would
recommend putting it. If your gate is here now,
yeah, it has to be there. Yeah. That will work.
MR. JORDAN: That would be my only
question.
MR. ROMANSKI: It's still going to be
on the outside. I would be comfortable making a
motion making that adjustment to the fence and
extending it north to the other ornamental fence
you have there. I believe it's a cleaner feel.
That's what I would make a motion for.
MR. PUTNAM: But I guess I'm just
speaking out loud, would that require us to come
back?
MR. ROMANSKI: He would know all the
answers to those kind of things.
MR. PUTNAM: If we do the straight
extended out, do we have to come back to another
meeting?
MR. KOZOR: If it's not changing the
width necessarily because my ordinance is written
that it's extending -- what is it?
MR. LATROFA: It won't increase the
extension from the building towards Nicholas so it
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will actually --
MR. CHILDRESS: It would still be in
the same 72-foot alignment --
MR. BOOKLER: Right.
MR. CHILDRESS: -- off the building
to the east or nearest front corner just aligns to
the east and a greater length north.
MR. KOZOR: Potentially, there
wouldn't be any need for anything else. If
someone would want to make a motion as is, we can
make a motion, see if there's a vote. And if it
fails, you can make another motion.
MR. CHILDRESS: Like an amended
motion?
MR. ROMANSKI: I guess ask if there's
a motion based on how it's presented.
MR. BOOKLER: I'm 50/50 here. I
totally get -- I see that point. I'm not an
expert on snow removal and logistics. And it's
just, you know, what the property owners want.
And it doesn't affect the site lines or anything
and building engineering doesn't have any
problems. But I don't know if that truly is going
to be a problem and the safety. I would lean
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towards that.
MR. ROMANSKI: I think if we extend
it out, it's just a cleaner look.
MR. BOOKLER: I agree with that.
MR. ROMANSKI: You have the fence
that stops and then you have a gap and then you
have another fence. Where if you just extend it
out, you just look at it, it looks like it's one
fence going straight across, and it's a lot
cleaner looking.
MR. BOOKLER: What about if we
continued it and got more information about if you
guys wanted to look at possibly doing that, if
that would be something feasible? To continue the
meeting and just go back and look at moving that
gate -- extending it north.
MR. LATROFA: Really, I anticipate
the answer is going to be we need to talk to the
tenant, and the tenant is going to say I want to
get in there sooner rather than later, and I have
other places I want to go. I don't think it's
a -- if you feel like you're 50/50, you can vote
yes on the vote. It's not like they're mutually
exclusive. If you say yes, I agree with it as is.
MARY WOOLSEY, C.S.R. 630.248.3415
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And if that doesn't pass, yes, I agree with the
amended. You can do that.
MR. BOOKLER: Right.
MR. LATROFA: I think it's in the
best interest of the Village to make a
determination now to get the Board insight as
opposed to having them go back and, you know --
MR. BOOKLER: We've done continuances
before.
MR. LATROFA: I understand.
MR. BOOKLER: No. I get the
timeline.
MR. LATROFA: I just think it's in
the best interest of the Village to continue to be
open to business and to balance the needs of
business with the needs of the --
MR. BOOKLER: I definitely want to
help.
MR. CHILDRESS: Tony, do you have a
suggestion?
MR. DAMPTZ: What are your thoughts
on moving it?
MR. ROMANSKI: You know your client
better than we do, obviously.
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MR. PUTNAM: Yeah. I was just
thinking if -- only if there's something I'm not
thinking of for the security reason. The security
team is put together and they create certain ways
if there's a certain very specific security reason
they couldn't go that way that I don't know of.
MR. DAMPTZ: Cameras maybe viewing
because you're moving the gate so maybe they would
have to --
MR. PUTNAM: I don't know if there's
something I'm missing on that end of it.
MR. ROMANSKI: Look at the security.
Imagine I'm just some Joe Schmoe who wants to
cause problems. I can just walk in there with a
ten -foot -long or whatever width that is, but prop
a piece of wood up there, get in there, I'm good.
If you have a fence extending all the way, I can't
do that. I think it would be more secure
extending it out.
MR. PUTNAM: I don't know if there's
something I'm not thinking of or I'm not aware of
that they went with a specific route here. But I
have no problem asking, going straight through and
it could be as simple as yeah, that's good, we're
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okay with it.
MR. CHILDRESS: Do we want to have
one vote on -- or motion for the original zoning
variation?
MR. ROMANSKI: Is there anybody that
wants to make a motion on the original variation?
MR. CHILDRESS: And depending on --
can you have two motions in the affirmative, A or
B?
MR. KOZOR: No. If one passes, that
passes. If one fails, then you can make another
motion.
MR. ROMANSKI: If the first one
passes, then we're done. If it doesn't, then we
can make the amended motion and see if that
passes.
MR. CHILDRESS: Right. Okay.
MR. ROMANSKI: So that's a question.
Does anybody want to make a motion to amend the
motion as presented -- to make a motion to approve
as presented.
MR. BOOKLER: To approve the variance
as requested?
MR. CHILDRESS: Can I have a -- well,
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can I ask for -- can I make a motion?
MR. SERRANO: I will make a motion --
MR. CHILDRESS: Okay. Roberto.
MR. SERRANO: -- as is.
MR. CHILDRESS: That's a motion in
the current -- or as written.
MR. SERRANO: Yes.
MR. CHILDRESS: Is there a second?
MR. BOOKER: You know, I am going to
second it, and I'm going to trust that you guys
are going to go back and look at that and
seriously take that into consideration with the
logistics and engineering and all that. You know,
like Donato was saying, we know you have a
timeline as well, so...
MR. DAMPTZ: One question. If we
vote yes as it is today and they go back and
decide, hey, we want to move it the way we're
talking about doing it, what happens?
MR. ROMANSKI: If we vote yes, they
don't have to do anything. It's approved. They
can move forward. They don't have to go back to
their tenant, nothing. It's just we've approved
they can do it exactly as how it is presented.
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They don't have to go back to their tenant and ask
them to do anything.
MR. DAMPTZ: They could go back and
say what do think of this idea of moving the
fence, would that have to be another appeal?
MR. ROMANSKI: That would have to be
another, yes.
MR. KOZOR: No. Because it's 72
back, it would still be 72 back and that's the
only --
MR. CHILDRESS: It would still be as
written. So you basically have the same offset
off the nearest front corner of the building
adjacent or whatever, so that line projected
north, if you extended this easterly extent --
easterly fence, whatever, across these three
parking spaces, if they're 11 feet wide or
whatever the widths are, if you extend that up to
this north line and cut that off just to make the
fence routing perpendicular in the offset off the
nearest front corner --
MR. ROMANSKI: Based on how it's
written, we're not changing -- we're just changing
aesthetics.
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MR. CHILDRESS: So that could be a
design change that they can functionally review
with the property owners? They can make that
change on their own with the property owners and
their security consultant recommendations, they
can do that if they have Village approval and
still meet the requirements of the ordinance. So
the bottom line is basically, you know, if we have
a motion to follow the zoning variation as
requested, and if we vote in favor, then it would
be a recommendation to the Village Board. They
have final say-so on the variance or any given
variance. And then once voted in the affirmative,
then the property owner and staff team have
approval then to go ahead with their proposed
variation as far as what that allows them then to
do.
MR. ROMANSKI: If they extend it
north, what does the Village have to do?
MR. KOZOR: I would just have to
amend the exhibit.
MR. DAMPTZ: So no big deal.
MR. CHILDRESS: It's not the text of
the exhibit, it's just the graphics, the
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attachment?
MR. KOZOR: That is correct.
MR. BOOKLER: And, again, building
and engineering, after you and Jared asked all
those questions, you were fine with how it's
constructed?
MR. KOZOR: That is correct.
MR. BOOKLER: Okay.
MR. CHILDRESS: Okay. We had a
motion in favor of the proposed variation request
by Roberto, seconded by Ryan.
MR. BOOKLER: Sure.
MR. CHILDRESS: Can we have a voice
vote. Roberto.
MR. SERRANO: Approval.
MR. BOOKLER: Yes.
MR. CHILDRESS: Ryan.
Rich.
MR. ROMANSKI: I'm going to go ahead
and say no.
MR. CHILDRESS: I'm yes.
Donato.
MR. LATROFA: Same as Rich. No.
MR. CHILDRESS: Tony.
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MR. DAMPTZ: Yes.
MR. GLIMCO: Yes.
MR. CHILDRESS: Okay.
Thank you.
Yeah, Jake.
So we voted, for those
attending, five in favor, two against and then two
not present tonight. So it would be in favor of
the proposed variation request. The Chair, in
this case being me, puts together a finding of
fact. Bryan and Village staff attending puts
together meeting minutes. These go to advise the
Village Board.
Bryan, when is the next
Village Board meeting? 23rd of March?
MR. KOZOR: Yes.
MR. CHILDRESS: So that will be the
next Village Board meeting. If you could, the
Village clerk should probably be calling you
before then, but if you can also confirm that
you're on the docket before the 23rd of March
meeting. And if it is on the docket if you can
please plan to attend. And, you know, have your
exhibits and, you know, if you can attend to
answer any questions of the Village Board.
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Because they will have final recommendation on the
passage of the variation. Then at that point it
passes, then you can coordinate with Village
engineering to place the fence as proposed, or
anything within the requirements of the variation
that you're coordinating with the Village.
MR. PUTNAM: Okay. Thank you.
MR. CHILDRESS: I thank you for your
well -made exhibits. They so often help for
clarity to the variance requests and answer a lot
of these questions that we have from different
points of view and understanding the
interrelationship with utilities and site drainage
and nearby properties and traffic flow and all
these different things like this. So thank you
for coming tonight and for attending.
MR. PUTNAM: Thank you. Thank you
for your insight, too. We appreciate it.
MR. JORDAN: Thank you.
MR. CHILDRESS: I will go ahead we
can adjourn. The time is approximately --
MR. BOOKLER: Make a motion to
adj ourn .
MR. CHILDRESS: Can we have a motion
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to adjourn.
to adjourn.
favor?
MR. ROMANSKI: I will make a motion
MR. LATROFA: Second.
MR. CHILDRESS: Donato seconded.
MR. LATROFA: Yes.
MR. CHILDRESS: Thank you. All in
ALL COMMISSIONERS: Aye.
MR. CHILDRESS: Thank you.
(Which were al 1 the
proceedings had in the
above -entitled cause.)
(Whereupon, the hearing ended
at 7:47 p.m.)
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STATE OF ILLINOIS )
COUNTY OF COOK j
I, MARY WOOLSEY, C.S.R., do hereby
certify that I am a court reporter doing business
in the City of Chicago; that I reported in
shorthand the testimony given at the
above -entitled hearing on March 11, 2021; and that
the foregoing is a true and correct transcript of
my shorthand notes so taken as aforesaid.
C....
er ed hurt and or —ter
Illinois C.S.R. License No. 084-002894
MARY WOOLSEY, C.S.R. 630.248.3415